How childhood trauma, religious rigidity, and family dynamics shape adult identity—and how emotional healing begins with reclaiming your story.
Childhood experiences shape how individuals perceive themselves, relationships, and the world. When these experiences are embedded within emotionally volatile households and strict religious shifts, the psychological effects can last decades. One speaker recounts growing up in an environment where emotional expression was discouraged, mental health was ignored, and parenting roles were dictated by survival rather than nurture. In these conditions, panic attacks and anxiety were misinterpreted as attention-seeking, while deeper psychological distress was met with indifference or mockery. This reflection underscores how emotional neglect can distort a child’s self-concept and identity development.
The episode further delves into the role of family dynamics and sibling positioning in shaping behavior. From being the “crap leftover” to the “black egg,” both speakers discuss the lasting impact of labels, favoritism, and misperceived roles. These roles often set the stage for later adult behaviors, including substance use and rebellion, as mechanisms for reclaiming control and visibility. The emotional asymmetry within families often goes unnoticed, yet it quietly influences every adult relationship and self-perception that follows.
A critical theme explored is the sudden introduction of strict religious dogma into family life. One speaker describes her mother’s abrupt conversion to Jehovah’s Witnesses, which dismantled the family’s identity as free-spirited, artistic, and socially liberal. The mother’s transformation demanded immediate compliance from the family, eliminating holidays and contact with non-believers, including relatives. This transition wasn’t merely about religion—it was about emotional abandonment under the guise of spiritual salvation. For the child, it was a disorienting rupture, creating a false narrative of familial rejection and instilling lifelong trust issues.
As these women reflect on their upbringing, a powerful truth emerges: healing doesn’t happen until the narrative is reclaimed. Therapy, sobriety, and raw conversation become tools for identity repair. The scars of conditional love, suppressed mental health, and performative religion underscore a broader cultural challenge—how emotional trauma masquerades as structure, and how many adult women are left trying to reparent themselves.
Meet the Expert
Emily Baggen brings firsthand insight as someone raised within the emotionally repressive framework of a volatile household and a restrictive religious environment. Her voice serves as a powerful case study on the emotional labor women carry when raised in psychologically dismissive and hyper-controlled environments. Her journey—through trauma, religious indoctrination, and ultimately toward emotional awareness—provides invaluable wisdom for anyone exploring the intersection of mental health, family systems, and spiritual identity.
The Big Idea
The core theme of this conversation is the emotional and psychological fragmentation caused when religion is introduced not as a belief system but as a mechanism for control. The episode explores how emotionally unstable households often adopt rigid religious ideologies as a coping framework, thereby intensifying isolation and invalidation for children. This “emotional bait-and-switch” creates generational trauma disguised as morality, leaving individuals struggling with identity confusion, chronic anxiety, and fractured familial bonds.
Key Takeaways
- Emotional invalidation breeds internalized shame. When children’s distress is dismissed as “attention-seeking,” it sets the stage for lifelong struggles with self-worth and anxiety.
- Religious extremism introduced during formative years can feel like identity theft. Especially when used as an emotional escape for parents rather than a path to spiritual growth.
- Family labels can imprison identity. Roles like “the scapegoat,” “the black egg,” or “the good one” distort development and often carry into adulthood unless consciously dismantled.
- Healing requires reframing. Therapy, sobriety, and vulnerable storytelling help survivors reclaim ownership of their experiences and restore emotional agency.
- Consistency is more critical than ideology in parenting. Sudden lifestyle overhauls, especially ones fueled by rigid religious conversion, destabilize children’s sense of safety.
Tools, Strategies, or Frameworks Mentioned
- Narrative Reclamation: A personal practice of reviewing and rewriting one’s upbringing story with a lens of compassion and clarity—crucial for trauma recovery.
- Emotional Role Mapping: Understanding how each family member plays a part in the household dynamic to identify inherited behaviors and beliefs.
- Sobriety as Clarity Work: Removing substances not only for health but to allow deeper emotional introspection, particularly into suppressed trauma.
- Contrast Parenting Analysis: Comparing how different siblings experienced the same parents as a way to contextualize individual trauma within broader family systems.
Final Thoughts
“You’re a square peg in a round hole—and you always were.” This episode reminds us that not fitting in isn’t failure; it’s often the first sign of inner truth. Whether in rigid religious systems or emotionally chaotic households, being the “problem child” often just means being the one who sees through the performance. And that vision? That’s the beginning of healing.
Full Transcript
Speaker A 00:00:00.320 - 00:00:18.320 A different person outside, but she was the same miserable person inside. She. I knew she had a temper. I knew she was just horrible. But then, you know, we would go to the Kingdom hall and she was like this whole different person. So it was. It was this traumatic experience. It was horrible. Speaker B 00:00:22.880 - 00:00:59.390 Hello and welcome to Pissy But Pretty, a show about hindsight, hope, tangents and cuss words. We are your hosts. Party tricks turned. Semi responsible women. I am your host, Heather Cairns and Emily Baggen. Pissy but pretty episode dos. Thanks for staying with us and I'm glad that you came back. We needed it. Thank you for still being here after listening to the first episode. Speaker A 00:00:59.470 - 00:01:03.130 The first episode was epic and it was amazing. And I'm surprised there. Speaker B 00:01:03.610 - 00:01:04.170 Yeah. Speaker A 00:01:04.250 - 00:01:04.970 Not here. Speaker B 00:01:05.210 - 00:01:08.650 Right. Again, I'm your host, Heather Cairns. Speaker A 00:01:08.730 - 00:01:09.770 Emily Baggin. Speaker B 00:01:10.730 - 00:01:18.650 And in this one, we are. What? Aren't you allowed to do nothing? Speaker A 00:01:18.650 - 00:01:20.170 Okay, I'm not allowed to say it. Speaker B 00:01:20.170 - 00:01:24.170 This one we are talking about childhood and religion. Speaker A 00:01:24.170 - 00:01:24.650 Yeah. Speaker B 00:01:24.810 - 00:01:37.740 Which we go deep so it might spill over into. Oh, I said that we go deep so it might spill over. It might spill over into episode three. Speaker A 00:01:38.060 - 00:01:42.700 It could. It might. There's a lot going on in the childhood. There's a lot going on with religion. Speaker B 00:01:42.860 - 00:01:43.260 Yeah. Speaker A 00:01:43.260 - 00:01:50.380 But again, as far as religion is concerned, this is our experience with that religion. Speaker B 00:01:50.460 - 00:01:54.140 100% not gonna debate, not gonna, you. Speaker A 00:01:54.140 - 00:01:55.900 Know, try to do. Speaker B 00:01:56.460 - 00:02:09.670 Putting any religion down. That's a good psa. We are just telling you our experience. If it happens to be unfavorable in a certain religion, maybe it's us. Speaker A 00:02:09.670 - 00:02:10.270 Here's a correct. Speaker B 00:02:10.270 - 00:02:11.190 We're not saying it's not. Speaker A 00:02:11.190 - 00:02:13.270 Go to the city and talk to somebody who cares. Speaker B 00:02:13.590 - 00:02:14.710 Okay. Speaker A 00:02:15.190 - 00:02:15.670 Sorry. Speaker B 00:02:15.830 - 00:02:17.430 Okay. You don't even like the city. Speaker A 00:02:17.510 - 00:02:19.510 I don't. I don't go east of Brookfield. Speaker B 00:02:19.590 - 00:02:21.630 It's crazy. All right. Speaker A 00:02:21.630 - 00:02:22.150 Okay. Speaker B 00:02:22.150 - 00:02:23.550 So childhood and religion. Speaker A 00:02:23.550 - 00:02:29.020 Childhood and religion. Childhood was where it all started, obviously, for us. Speaker B 00:02:29.740 - 00:02:30.860 Well, we have to be born. Speaker A 00:02:30.940 - 00:02:32.620 We have to be born. I was born. Speaker B 00:02:34.380 - 00:02:39.660 Nope, don't say it. You're going to quote the movie the Jerk with Steve Martin. Great movie. Speaker A 00:02:39.740 - 00:02:40.580 Can't quote it. Speaker B 00:02:40.580 - 00:02:40.900 No. Speaker A 00:02:40.900 - 00:02:41.579 Can't quote it. Speaker B 00:02:41.579 - 00:02:42.060 Nope. Speaker A 00:02:44.300 - 00:02:47.340 I remember very little about my childhood. Speaker B 00:02:47.340 - 00:02:48.420 That's insane to me. Speaker A 00:02:48.420 - 00:03:15.470 I remember very little. I remember a lot of dark, dark things going on. Dark things happening. Kind of being the opposite, I would imagine, of your family dynamic. Perpetually lonely. I was obviously born in the 70s and then raised 80s and 90s when mental health was not a thing. Speaker B 00:03:15.550 - 00:03:16.550 Was not a thing. Speaker A 00:03:16.550 - 00:03:19.230 It was not a thing. So I started having panic attacks. Speaker B 00:03:19.390 - 00:03:22.270 Mental health was a thing. How to address it wasn't a thing. Speaker A 00:03:22.350 - 00:03:38.250 Right. I was a handful because I never felt good. I always was panicking. I had anxiety. People scared me. Leaving my mom scared me. It was awful. So yeah, there was that. Speaker B 00:03:38.330 - 00:03:50.890 I can't picture being lonely. And what's funny is I was just talking about this with my mom yesterday. We don't do anything by ourselves in my family. No, Never? Speaker A 00:03:51.130 - 00:03:51.530 No. Speaker B 00:03:51.530 - 00:04:04.950 Like there's so many of us. I'm the oldest out of five and you have seven people in one house. For a long time we shared one bathroom, so I shared a bed with. Speaker A 00:04:04.950 - 00:04:06.310 Your dad have soap on a rope? Speaker B 00:04:06.950 - 00:04:08.390 Why would he have soap on a rope? Speaker A 00:04:08.390 - 00:04:11.430 My dad had soap on a rope and we all used it. Speaker B 00:04:12.790 - 00:04:14.150 I don't think that's right. Speaker A 00:04:15.510 - 00:04:16.950 Anyway, seven people. Speaker B 00:04:17.270 - 00:04:19.030 Seven people, Yeah. Speaker A 00:04:19.030 - 00:04:26.600 I just had four. Mom, dad, my sister that was five years older and we had nothing in common. She hated me from the second I came into store. Speaker B 00:04:26.600 - 00:04:27.320 You and your sister? Speaker A 00:04:27.640 - 00:04:28.040 Yeah. Speaker B 00:04:28.040 - 00:04:30.920 Well, she's a ginger. Sometimes they're angry. She's. Speaker A 00:04:30.920 - 00:04:31.880 Yeah, yeah. Speaker B 00:04:31.960 - 00:04:32.760 No soul. Speaker A 00:04:33.080 - 00:04:34.120 She has no soul. Speaker B 00:04:34.360 - 00:04:36.600 Cracks me up though. Your sister, I love her. Speaker A 00:04:36.840 - 00:04:37.440 Absolutely. Speaker B 00:04:37.440 - 00:04:38.200 As do you. Speaker A 00:04:38.200 - 00:04:39.000 As do I. Speaker B 00:04:39.400 - 00:04:42.840 But you guys have more in common now. I feel like you have a lot in common. Speaker A 00:04:42.920 - 00:04:46.520 Yeah. We didn't get close until later. Much later. Speaker B 00:04:46.680 - 00:04:47.240 Yeah. Speaker A 00:04:47.400 - 00:04:47.800 So. Speaker B 00:04:48.290 - 00:05:37.930 Well, yeah, so being one out of seven too, in my house, like we always had so much going on. There was so much chaos. I shared a bed with my sister until I was 15 years old when my parents could afford. My mom was a stay at home mom. So when she started working, she went back to school when the youngest in my family went to school and became a nurse. And so then they could afford to build a house and I didn't have to share a bed with my sister anymore. But it was weird. Like I'll tell you, we all got our own rooms and especially my younger siblings weren't used to it. So they would sneak off and still sleep. It was strange. So feeling lonely, I would have liked a little time to myself. My God, that wasn't a thing in my house, right? Speaker A 00:05:38.250 - 00:06:04.550 Yeah, it was. And we didn't do. We didn't do things. It wasn't like, oh, let's go on vacation every year. It was a joke in my family that we went on vacation like once every eight years. My family watched tv and this is what we did. We watched movies. So I was raised on movies. And like still at 45 years old, the majority of things that come out of my mouth Are quotes from movies. Speaker B 00:06:04.950 - 00:06:06.070 That's one thing I love about that. Speaker A 00:06:06.070 - 00:06:15.510 Fucking hilarious. Because it's funny and whatever, but there are times that I'm like, okay, have you had something original come out between your soup coolers at all today? Speaker B 00:06:15.860 - 00:06:21.940 Soup coolers. I also love it when you say that. Yeah, it's a lot of substance to you. Speaker A 00:06:22.020 - 00:06:24.260 Thanks. I'm deep. Speaker B 00:06:24.340 - 00:06:25.700 You are. You go deep. Speaker A 00:06:27.540 - 00:06:52.170 Yeah. So the sister, redhead, she was the performer. She was kind of the. Took up all of the oxygen in the room. Very outgoing, very flamboyant, just bigger than life. There was no space for me. And it was just kind of that joke that. Yeah, this is. This is Amy, and this is Amy's sister. I never really had a name so much, so it was. Yeah, it was in the shadow. Speaker B 00:06:52.170 - 00:06:53.050 Did you choose yours? Speaker A 00:06:53.610 - 00:07:03.850 I would not have chosen Emily. Not at all. Because in crowds when you're like, emily, Emily. They're like, all right, Kevin, go sit down. And it's like, all right. You didn't hear me. Speaker B 00:07:04.250 - 00:07:06.810 Nobody knows my name better than Karen. Speaker A 00:07:07.050 - 00:07:09.930 Karen these days. It could be Deborah. Speaker B 00:07:10.400 - 00:07:12.000 Deborah. Anyway, okay. Speaker A 00:07:13.120 - 00:07:27.200 So, yeah, it was kind of always a joke that I was the crap leftover from my sister. Not really a joke necessarily for me, but that was kind of what she called me as we got older. You're like, yeah, you were just. She's like, you were just the crap leftover. I was like, kinda. That's just sort of how it was. Speaker B 00:07:27.200 - 00:07:28.880 Parents didn't make you feel any different. Speaker A 00:07:28.960 - 00:07:29.320 Mm. Speaker B 00:07:29.320 - 00:07:31.360 Mm. That's so sad. Speaker A 00:07:31.760 - 00:07:52.690 No, it was a strange. Strange sort of vanilla existence. Yeah, we were just kind of going through the motions. Going through the motions. My mom was always very volatile, had a temper, that sort of thing. So it was always sort of. As long as she was okay, everything was good in the house. Yeah. Speaker B 00:07:52.690 - 00:07:53.050 Yeah. Speaker A 00:07:53.130 - 00:07:55.690 And my dad was very chill, so it was. Speaker B 00:07:55.850 - 00:08:04.140 Well. Cause if you. Can you imagine if both of your parents were. And if she wasn't okay, then what? There was hell to pay. Speaker A 00:08:04.300 - 00:08:19.060 There was hell to pay. It was loud. It was loud. We would just sort of disappear and be like, okay, well, whatever we can do. My dad would just sort of do whatever he could to just sort of calm the beast kind of thing. She was always very unhappy, very unfulfilled. Speaker B 00:08:19.060 - 00:08:20.420 Had her own mental health problem. Speaker A 00:08:20.420 - 00:08:56.430 Had her own mental health problems. Of course, you know, boomers, they just do. And you don't deal with your problems. You don't deal with what's going on in your brain. Back in the day, they just didn't do that right. So my dad's dad died when my dad was 14. So he was very mature from a very young age and took care of her. He had always taken care of her. That was just the thing. So I kind of was born, they said because my sister needed something to do. She was too much and she needed something to do. She needed something to play with. Speaker B 00:08:57.320 - 00:08:58.520 You were her pretty little pet. Speaker A 00:08:58.600 - 00:09:04.040 I was the pretty little pet. I mean. Yeah. Now you can get paid for that. Speaker B 00:09:06.280 - 00:09:07.640 You should have been paid for that. Speaker A 00:09:07.640 - 00:09:12.840 I should have been paid for a little pup. Yeah. So that was that. That was. Speaker B 00:09:13.480 - 00:09:17.400 Well, in my house, I was also the problem. Speaker A 00:09:21.080 - 00:09:23.640 We are still the problem. We are still the problem. Speaker B 00:09:23.720 - 00:09:24.440 Still the problem. Speaker A 00:09:24.440 - 00:09:25.720 And that's why we're here. Speaker B 00:09:26.350 - 00:09:29.950 Talk about our problems and to share it with the rest of the problems of the world. Speaker A 00:09:30.110 - 00:09:30.750 Thank you. Speaker B 00:09:32.110 - 00:09:52.550 Yeah, I was too much. I was the oldest. I don't know, like, if you would say, looking back, like, maybe I had some hyper stuff or was it because I was trying to stand out, trying to get some attention. When you got five kids, you have. Speaker A 00:09:52.550 - 00:09:56.910 To do something pretty extreme in order for your parents to even notice that you're there. Speaker B 00:09:57.070 - 00:10:25.210 Right. I remember just trying. My sister, that's a year younger than me, she was the goody two shoes, very smart, got the good grades. I stood out because I was the complete opposite of her. I stood out as the funny one, as the one that would get in trouble and some. You know how you just fall into a role, right? Of course. Every family, everybody falls into their role. Speaker A 00:10:25.210 - 00:10:26.290 Everyone's got their niche. Speaker B 00:10:26.290 - 00:10:41.630 And that was just my role. And sometimes I loved it because then you don't expect too much from me. Which also goes into our partying days. Like, oh, Heather was crazy again last night and she's hungover today. Good. Then you don't expect too much from me. Speaker A 00:10:41.630 - 00:10:42.190 You really don't. Speaker B 00:10:42.190 - 00:10:54.630 That's what you think. But sometimes having a serious thought or an idea or wanting to be taken seriously never happened. Speaker A 00:10:54.630 - 00:10:56.830 No, ma' am. No, you shut your mouth. Speaker B 00:10:56.830 - 00:11:00.130 The lack of respect was always. Yes. Speaker A 00:11:00.130 - 00:11:02.410 The black sheep doesn't get that respect. Speaker B 00:11:02.650 - 00:11:05.370 They actually called me the black egg. Black sheep, bad egg. Speaker A 00:11:06.090 - 00:11:09.130 That's horrible. Is that worse than the crap left over? Speaker B 00:11:09.530 - 00:11:10.210 Maybe so. Speaker A 00:11:10.210 - 00:11:10.810 I don't know. Speaker B 00:11:11.290 - 00:11:17.690 I do say I did teach my siblings what not to do. They have told me that. Speaker A 00:11:18.410 - 00:11:19.690 Yeah. Yeah. Speaker B 00:11:20.010 - 00:11:44.640 But I think always being treated as the one that was in trouble, I mean, sometimes was it deserved. Absolutely. But everything was always my fault. Yeah, everything was. Ugh. We gotta go deal with Heather, again. My sister has even admitted to purposely getting me in trouble because she could make herself cry. I wasn't a crier. Speaker A 00:11:44.720 - 00:11:45.080 No. Speaker B 00:11:45.080 - 00:11:46.480 Still am not a crier. Speaker A 00:11:46.559 - 00:11:47.680 Gross. Please don't. Speaker B 00:11:47.680 - 00:12:06.320 Ew. Ew. Ugly cry face. And so, yeah, just like, that was me. And I don't know if it was any attention is good attention kind of thing, even if it's bad, but I sure did have a lot of fun. My family was close. Speaker A 00:12:06.880 - 00:12:07.400 That's right. Speaker B 00:12:07.400 - 00:12:18.480 We still are close. Very close. But there's still, like. I feel like there's still some proving I need to do always. I am not that person anymore. Speaker A 00:12:18.560 - 00:12:19.040 Yeah. Speaker B 00:12:19.120 - 00:12:20.000 I mean, when's the last time? Speaker A 00:12:20.000 - 00:12:20.800 But you was still. Speaker B 00:12:22.160 - 00:12:22.560 Yeah. Speaker A 00:12:22.560 - 00:12:23.040 I don't know. Speaker B 00:12:23.040 - 00:12:25.200 My face couldn't take it if we broke my thumb. Speaker A 00:12:25.520 - 00:12:27.760 Yeah. Totally broke my face. Yeah. Broke your face. Speaker B 00:12:27.760 - 00:12:28.550 Yeah. Yeah. Speaker A 00:12:28.860 - 00:12:54.940 You remind me of sort of the conversations now that I have with my sister that's five years older, and just she felt like she was always to blame. She was the scapegoat. I was the perfect one. And it's interesting to hear those dynamics between the two of us, because that is not my experience at all. And I'm sure if you talk to all four of your siblings, they had a very different upbringing. Speaker B 00:12:54.940 - 00:12:55.500 Very different. Speaker A 00:12:55.500 - 00:13:31.960 Very different interpretation of your mom and dad. And I think that's so. And something that I'm still learning is sort of that, okay, there is a different perspective here. It wasn't dark. It wasn't as dark as I thought it was. But that's gonna take a long time for me to get through and get over, because for me, like I said, it was perpetually lonely. They thought that the stomach aches and the problems, the mental illness problems I was having was I needed attention. Emily's got a stomachache again. She's just being ridic. Speaker B 00:13:32.660 - 00:13:32.980 Drama. Speaker A 00:13:33.060 - 00:13:33.700 Fuck that. Speaker B 00:13:33.700 - 00:13:34.500 That's what my family was. Speaker A 00:13:34.500 - 00:13:35.380 That wasn't what that was. Speaker B 00:13:36.100 - 00:13:56.660 I'll be like, do you remember when this happened? And they'll be like, oh, Heather, you're being dramatic again. And it's like, just because you don't remember it. I remember it. And I remember always being the one in trouble. I often tell my sister Hillary, I wish I had a relationship with my dad like Hillary did. Speaker A 00:13:56.660 - 00:13:57.260 Yeah. Yeah. Speaker B 00:13:57.260 - 00:14:02.830 They were very close. When she moved home from college and moved back in, they called each other roomies. Speaker A 00:14:03.070 - 00:14:03.870 That's adorable. Speaker B 00:14:04.430 - 00:14:18.750 I didn't have that. My dad and I were very much alike. We were both jokesters. But we also would get in these epic screaming matches. And because we both needed the last word at all times. Of course, we were ending screaming matches. Speaker A 00:14:18.750 - 00:14:19.390 Of course. Speaker B 00:14:21.870 - 00:15:30.540 But then, like literally just last week when we were cleaning out my mom's condo, she's. If you didn't catch it in the first episode, she's dealing with brain cancer right now. We just moved her into a nursing home. But my sister's just found out, or found in going through her stuff, a letter that my dad had written me and now my dad me. My dad passed away 13 years ago from ALS and I still haven't brought myself to read it really. But, yeah, and my sisters, I said, like when they. Yeah, I'm scared of what's in it. No, but my sisters are like, you need this. And I'm like, why is it? Talking about how I'm a big disappointment. And for some odd reason, even though I went about it in all the wrong ways, I wanted that man to be proud of me 100%. To get his approval and to make him proud was so important to me. But I think it was so unattainable to me, or I felt that way, of course, that I just. And I went to the opposite extreme. Speaker A 00:15:30.540 - 00:15:30.980 Yeah. Speaker B 00:15:31.540 - 00:15:42.180 So they're like, nope, you need to read this. Heather, he actually was proud of you. I love that when you moved out and it's two page letter. Speaker A 00:15:42.259 - 00:15:42.980 Oh, my God. Speaker B 00:15:43.060 - 00:15:44.900 Yeah. I still. It's. I. Speaker A 00:15:44.980 - 00:15:45.620 That's amazing. Speaker B 00:15:45.620 - 00:15:49.780 One day, maybe by next time I'll read it, but I still haven't read it yet. Speaker A 00:15:49.860 - 00:15:50.420 Awesome. Speaker B 00:15:50.420 - 00:15:50.900 Yeah. Speaker A 00:15:51.300 - 00:16:09.060 What about religion? I mean, I know that your parents were religious. My experience with it, when I was about like 10, 11 years old, Jehovah's Witnesses came to my door. And my mother, who was miserable and looking for something and would disappear to live with her friends because we just didn't. Speaker B 00:16:09.140 - 00:16:09.780 Wait. What? Speaker A 00:16:09.780 - 00:16:10.740 Respect her. Speaker B 00:16:10.980 - 00:16:12.500 My disappeared to live with her friends. Speaker A 00:16:12.500 - 00:16:13.060 Oh, sure. Speaker B 00:16:13.620 - 00:16:14.580 So I'm coming over. Speaker A 00:16:14.900 - 00:16:15.340 Okay. Speaker B 00:16:15.340 - 00:16:16.020 Yeah, thanks. Speaker A 00:16:16.020 - 00:16:25.010 Yeah, she did. She would go live with her friends because, you know, my dad wasn't enough. We didn't respect her enough sort of thing. So the witnesses came to the door. Speaker B 00:16:25.010 - 00:16:29.930 I was crazy as a child. Like, where's Mom? Off at Betty's. Speaker A 00:16:30.890 - 00:17:19.910 Oh, Betty Nuggs. So, yeah, she would leave, but she was looking for something. The witnesses came to the door and all of a sudden, that was her thing. That was her thing. It seemed overnight we went from this way. My parents were hippies, they smoked weed, they were artists, they were painters and that kind of thing, which I thought was cool. I thought that was kind of cool. We did A lot of social things that way. Occasionally, at least what I thought was a lot of social things anyway. But, yeah, once she became a Jehovah's Witness, it was a 180, because she went full bore. We have to change everything. And either you do it or you're losing me. So it was, you're this crazy hippie. Speaker B 00:17:20.150 - 00:17:31.780 Person, and how you can then go to one of the strictest religions there is. Right. And to the extreme spirit. Yeah. And she went in. Speaker A 00:17:31.860 - 00:17:33.860 Yeah, she went in. She went in. Speaker B 00:17:34.020 - 00:17:35.140 Immersed herself. Speaker A 00:17:35.300 - 00:18:42.750 It was heavy. It was very heavy. It was never. To this day, I don't think it was something my dad ever wanted to do. He read every book that the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society ever put out over, like, five years. And then, you know, finally kind of resigned himself to that fact. My mom was then a different person outside, but she was the same miserable person inside. I knew she had a temper. I knew she was just horrible. But then, you know, we would go to the Kingdom hall, and she was like this whole different person. So it was this traumatic experience. It was horrible. It was a traumatic experience. You know, I could talk about this for days and days and days and days and probably never have somebody feel how awful it was during that time to figure out who we were, what we were supposed to do for her because she was miserable. Found something that was amazing, completely without us. And then, like I said, it was kind of. She gave us this ultimatum, like, well, either you're gonna do this with me or you're against me. Speaker B 00:18:43.200 - 00:18:51.920 Well. And kids like consistency, right? Like, kids always want consistency. Every single holiday swept from underneath you. Speaker A 00:18:52.240 - 00:19:31.200 Yes. Every holiday was gone. And we did big. We did Christmases big. We didn't have a huge family. But I remember every Christmas and New Year's and Thanksgiving, and it stopped. And her reasoning, to me, which I found later, much later in my adult life, her reasoning was, our family turned their back on us. The majority of our family are Catholic. And she said they turned their backs on us. And you're gonna find that, Emily, that's gonna happen throughout your life because you have the true religion. So people are gonna be mad at you. And I thought all of my cousins, all of my aunts and uncles, my grandpa and grandma, I thought they just left. Speaker B 00:19:31.600 - 00:19:42.840 And funny, oddly enough, I know your cousin. Mm. I do her hair. So we have had a long time to sit there. Cause she's got three heads worth of hair. Speaker A 00:19:42.840 - 00:19:45.160 She's very hairy. She's very hairy. Speaker B 00:19:45.240 - 00:19:50.680 Well, and that is the complete opposite of the Truth. Speaker A 00:19:51.240 - 00:20:03.920 It was probably within the last five years that I learned from my cousins we've started getting back together again, that that was not the case. It was my mom taking us and turning our back on them. Speaker B 00:20:03.920 - 00:20:07.750 Because I remember her saying how pissed she was for you back then. Speaker A 00:20:07.990 - 00:20:43.830 The anger is awful. These are, like I said, they're fairly new wounds. It's gnarly to go from, like I said, hippies, free spirits, to a very borderline cult sort of a situation. You're not allowed to communicate with anybody outside of that religion. That's what I was told, so. And then it's a religion, unfortunately, where my fucking ass did not fit in. I wasn't. I didn't. I wasn't built. I wasn't built for that. Speaker B 00:20:44.470 - 00:20:48.070 No. To fit in. No, no, no. We don't. Speaker A 00:20:48.070 - 00:20:50.950 We're square pegs in a round hole. Speaker B 00:20:52.070 - 00:20:53.350 I knew you were gonna say that. Speaker A 00:20:54.150 - 00:20:56.006 Of course I did. 180. Speaker B 00:20:56.134 - 00:20:56.710 180. Speaker A 00:20:56.710 - 00:21:06.300 It was a 180. It was traumatic experience. Something I didn't realize was as traumatic again until I quit drinking and started. Speaker B 00:21:07.100 - 00:21:10.060 Going to therapy and finding it. Yeah. Speaker A 00:21:10.060 - 00:21:19.540 Because surprisingly, the Jehovah's Witnesses that I was around introduced me to alcohol, introduced me to this, to that, to the other thing. Speaker B 00:21:19.540 - 00:21:20.340 Isn't that funny? Speaker A 00:21:20.340 - 00:21:28.850 I know all of these things that we're not supposed to do that you're never supposed to be around. You're not even supposed to hold hands before you get married and bullshit like that. Speaker B 00:21:28.850 - 00:21:31.250 Didn't you all like work together too and stuff? Speaker A 00:21:31.490 - 00:21:32.410 Basically, yeah. Speaker B 00:21:32.410 - 00:21:33.570 That's so weird. Speaker A 00:21:33.730 - 00:21:48.450 Yeah, a lot of them did. A lot of them did. Women were in subjection, so what's that mean? You're in subjection to your husband, so he goes to work and you are the stay at home mom and you go knocking on doors. That was your job. So. Yeah. Speaker B 00:21:48.450 - 00:21:52.310 Everyone loves it when you knock on their door. I do. If you have cookies. Speaker A 00:21:53.030 - 00:21:54.070 I never had cookies. Speaker B 00:21:54.310 - 00:21:57.270 I had the word of Jehovah. Yeah. Speaker A 00:21:57.750 - 00:22:06.430 The Watchtower and awake is what they were called. So uncomfortable. So uncomfortable. Knocking on strangers doors nowadays, you'll get your ass shot. Speaker B 00:22:06.430 - 00:22:06.790 Right? Speaker A 00:22:06.870 - 00:22:15.270 You can't be knocking on doors like that. I don't even know if they do it anymore. Honestly, I don't know. But you know, like I said, they felt like they had the true religion just as superiority. Speaker B 00:22:15.990 - 00:22:29.180 Why do the men not believe in long sleeve white shirts? I feel like I'm Mormon every time I see them walking around. They're all in short sleeve white shirts, black ties, black slacks. Speaker A 00:22:29.180 - 00:22:30.140 That's Mormon. Speaker B 00:22:30.540 - 00:22:34.220 They don't go knocking on doors, do they? Speaker A 00:22:35.340 - 00:22:35.900 They do. Speaker B 00:22:36.060 - 00:22:37.620 Okay, all right. Mormons do. Speaker A 00:22:37.620 - 00:22:38.140 Mm. Speaker B 00:22:38.540 - 00:22:43.900 We don't have a lot of Mormons in Wisconsin that I know of. At least they haven't knocked on my door. Speaker A 00:22:43.900 - 00:22:46.580 I don't know. Oh, I've seen Mormons. Speaker B 00:22:47.460 - 00:22:57.780 Okay, well, my religious experience we'll talk about in the next episode. Not nearly as gnarly as yours, but. Speaker A 00:22:57.780 - 00:23:00.899 Yeah, I love that you just used the word gnarly. Speaker B 00:23:01.380 - 00:23:26.360 I think you must have rubbed off on me. You used that word. Anyways, to be continued. We will come back to episode three where we will get into my religious experience and deeper delves into the Jehovah's Witnesses and everything that you've gone through out of that. Yeah. All right. Stay tuned. Peace. Speaker A 00:23:27.080 - 00:23:56.910 Thanks for letting us tickle your ear hole and not turning us off after the first 30 seconds. Don't forget to subscribe and join our email list to get in on the action. Sam.
